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In gold we trust

459 Posts
Pagina: «« 1 ... 18 19 20 21 22 23 »» | Laatste | Omlaag ↓
  1. [verwijderd] 22 augustus 2011 17:35
    Gold (GC : NASDAQ : US$1852.10), Net Change: 30.10, % Change: 1.65%
    The sum of all fears is...Gold continued its march towards $2,000 on Friday. News last week that Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez has ordered the repatriation of the country's $11 billion worth of gold reserves from U.S., European, Canadian and Swiss banks has lead to some backwardation in the gold market. Backwardation refers to the market condition wherein the price of a forward or futures contract is trading below the expected spot price at contract maturity. Zero Hedge notes that backwardation has rarely happened in the gold market since gold futures first started to be traded in 1972 – there have only been momentary backwardations of a few hours. The possibility of backwardation in gold suggests that investors are concerned about the supply of physical gold. Buyers are concerned about securing supply in the future and are willing to pay a premium for spot or immediate delivery. It could indicate that the short squeeze anticipated by many is taking place and the market could see a sharp upward move in gold prices. According to the World Gold Council, Venezuela holds a total of 365.8 tonnes of gold as official reserves. Of that, 211 tonnes is believed to be held abroad. Separately, from last week, Bespoke highlighted that the gold bull market is now over 1,000 days old. A bull market is defined as a rally of at least 20% that was preceded by a decline of at least 20%. The current bull market for gold – in which the yellow metal is up over 160% – it currently sits at 1,009 days. The last 20% decline for gold came from September 22, 2008 through November 13, 2008 when gold fell 22.04%. The median gold
    bull market since 1975 has lasted 418 days, so the current bull is well over double the median. The median gain seen during gold bull markets since 1975 has been 64.03%, so the current bull is about 2.5 times the median.

    If you don't trust GOLD,the only asset with a 6000 year track record, do you trust the logic of taking a $1,000 pine tree, cutting it up, turning it to pulp, putting some ink on it, and then calling it one billion $ dollars?
  2. [verwijderd] 19 september 2011 11:28
    The Dutch Ask Their Central Bank: "Where Is Our Gold?"
    Submitted by Tyler Durden on 09/18/2011 15:10 -0400

    Belgium Central Banks National Debt Ron Paul

    Think Ron Paul is the only person asking questions about the actual gold supposedly backing the currency in circulation. Think again: the "ask your central banker where his gold is" tour just went global after the Dutch the Dutch Socialists Party (SP)’s spokesman for financial affairs, Mr. Ewout Irrgang, asked the Dutch Secretary of the Treasury 10 detailed questions about the gold supposedly held by the Dutch Central Bank. Questions vary from: where is the gold? why are gold and gold receivables one line item? how much gold is loaned out? As Dutch website Vrijspreker.nl points out, "This is potentially a big breakthrough for global awareness on how central banks hide crucial info from the public and the disastrous effects central banks have on society." Is Belgium next to ask the same question in a vain attempt to understand just how much of its gold is permanently "lent out"? And after Belgium, everyone else with a central bank perhaps?

    The Questions:

    1 Did the Dutch Central Bank (DNB) loan part of their gold? If yes, how much and to whom?

    2 Why are gold and gold loans stated as one line item in the annual report 2010 instead of mentioned as 2 separate items?

    3 Can you give an overview of the yearly yields of the gold loans during the past years?

    4 Where IS the physical gold of DNB? At which locations and how much is where? What is the reason that the gold is still at these locations?

    5 What was the most important reason for DNB to sell the gold in the past? Are the storage costs a reason? What are the actual costs to store the gold?

    6 Can you confirm that since 1991 of the 1700 tons of gold about 1100 tons have been sold? Is the remark of journalist Peter de Waard correct that because of these historic sales there is a loss of about 30 billion euro? If not correct, what is the right amount?

    7 How much of the National Debt has during the past 20 years been paid off with the proceeds of the gold sales? Are you of opinion that the sustainability of the national debt will be improved by paying off the debt and at the same time selling the gold?

    8 What is in your opinion the present function of the gold stock?

    9 What is the relation between the size of the market of the gold stock and the size of the market of gold derivates? What are the possible consequences of this?

    10 Can you confirm that recently a number of countries have even enlarged their physical gold stock? Do you have an explanation for this development?

    If you don't trust GOLD,the only asset with a 6000 year track record, do you trust the logic of taking a $1,000 pine tree, cutting it up, turning it to pulp, putting some ink on it, and then calling it one billion $ dollars?
  3. [verwijderd] 19 september 2011 14:09
    quote:

    Gung Ho schreef op 19 september 2011 11:28:

    The Dutch Ask Their Central Bank: "Where Is Our Gold?"
    Submitted by Tyler Durden on 09/18/2011 15:10 -0400

    Belgium Central Banks National Debt Ron Paul

    Think Ron Paul is the only person asking questions about the actual gold supposedly backing the currency in circulation. Think again: the "ask your central banker where his gold is" tour just went global after the Dutch the Dutch Socialists Party (SP)’s spokesman for financial affairs, Mr. Ewout Irrgang, asked the Dutch Secretary of the Treasury 10 detailed questions about the gold supposedly held by the Dutch Central Bank. Questions vary from: where is the gold? why are gold and gold receivables one line item? how much gold is loaned out? As Dutch website Vrijspreker.nl points out, "This is potentially a big breakthrough for global awareness on how central banks hide crucial info from the public and the disastrous effects central banks have on society." Is Belgium next to ask the same question in a vain attempt to understand just how much of its gold is permanently "lent out"? And after Belgium, everyone else with a central bank perhaps?

    The Questions:

    1 Did the Dutch Central Bank (DNB) loan part of their gold? If yes, how much and to whom?

    2 Why are gold and gold loans stated as one line item in the annual report 2010 instead of mentioned as 2 separate items?

    3 Can you give an overview of the yearly yields of the gold loans during the past years?

    4 Where IS the physical gold of DNB? At which locations and how much is where? What is the reason that the gold is still at these locations?

    5 What was the most important reason for DNB to sell the gold in the past? Are the storage costs a reason? What are the actual costs to store the gold?

    6 Can you confirm that since 1991 of the 1700 tons of gold about 1100 tons have been sold? Is the remark of journalist Peter de Waard correct that because of these historic sales there is a loss of about 30 billion euro? If not correct, what is the right amount?

    7 How much of the National Debt has during the past 20 years been paid off with the proceeds of the gold sales? Are you of opinion that the sustainability of the national debt will be improved by paying off the debt and at the same time selling the gold?

    8 What is in your opinion the present function of the gold stock?

    9 What is the relation between the size of the market of the gold stock and the size of the market of gold derivates? What are the possible consequences of this?

    10 Can you confirm that recently a number of countries have even enlarged their physical gold stock? Do you have an explanation for this development?

    If you don't trust GOLD,the only asset with a 6000 year track record, do you trust the logic of taking a $1,000 pine tree, cutting it up, turning it to pulp, putting some ink on it, and then calling it one billion $ dollars?

    Ik ben zeer benieuwd naar de antwoorden.
  4. forum rang 7 ffff 19 september 2011 19:33
    Punt 4 vind ik persoonlijk te ver gaan.
    Punt 5 is in het verleden bij iedere grote verkoop steeds toegelicht. Dat begon al bij de verkopen door Duisenberg. Vraagsteller kan natuurlijk ook zelf wat huiswerk doen.
    Punt 6. Verkopen worden steeds gepubliceerd. De vraagstelling "loss" is een erg onnozele vraagstelling. Hij bedoelt: Wat had goud maximaal kunnen opbrengen als je het vandaag verkocht had. Maar daarmee zijn de mindere opbrengsten van jaren geleden natuurlijk nog geen "loss"
    Punt 7 Kan hij zelf uitrekenen
    Punt 8 Is wel interessant om eens te horen..
    Punt 9 Die vrag is al uitvoerig in de media behandeld. Die relatie is er nauwelijks. Als al het goud opgevraagd zou worden...bestaat het eenvoudigweg niet..
    Punt 10 Wordt gepubliceerd en dat moet je China, India maar zelf vragen!

    Ik vind de vraagstelling wat drammerig, maar daar zullen ze bij de Nederlandse Bank wel mee om kunnen gaan.

    Peter
  5. [verwijderd] 4 oktober 2011 22:23

    Just a quick note out there to all you physical silver and gold investors. The "delay" of the CFTC meeting on Position Limits from Oct 4th to Oct 18th was not only to give JP Morgan more time to try and get "on sides" with their silver position but also to give "the system" a couple more weeks after the end of the 3rd quarter to fully recognize the problems that fester at it's core. Don't be surprised at further short term delays but they are getting shorter and shorter.

    Remember what I said about JP Morgan's role in the latest silver manipulation:

    "If JP Morgan sticks with it's tried and true "Modus Operandi" they will continue this downward manipulation after allowing some new "bottom pickers" to get in at a supposed price support level. They will then force the price lower than anyone thinks and hold it there to "CHOKE OUT" everyone before allowing the price of silver to slowly rise to a more defensible position."

    JP Morgan "Operation Silver Slam"
    www.roadtoroota.com/public/592.cfm

    When position limits are implemented that part about "slowly rising" will be a MOON SHOT!

    And what of derivatives?

    The DOWNGRADE of the United States of America sent shock waves through the multi-Trillion dollar derivative market. The carnage will be visible in the next few weeks. Here's the largest derivative holders at the end of the second quarter according to the OCC:

    JP Morgan $78.1 Trillion
    Citibank $56.1 Trillion
    Bank of America $53.2 Trillion
    Goldman Sachs $47.7 Trillion

    It is said that derivatives are a negative sum game because there is always a winner and a loser. Unfortunately, this market has grown to such gigantic proportions that it is no longer true. The "Winners" will soon find those wins uncollectible as none of the counterparties can withstand the kind of losses coming down the pike. Hemorrhaging from either derivative losses or defaulted derivative gains the entire system is hanging by a computer rigged shoe string.

    Don't be surprised to see all four of these "too big to fail" banks go down by the end of the year.

    If you are frustrated that it is taking too long for the manipulation to end please remember...

    The United States has waited 100 years to free ourselves from the banksters...what's a few more weeks?!

    May the Road you choose be the Right Road!

    Bix Weir
    www.RoadtoRoota.com

    If you don't trust GOLD,the only asset with a 6000 year track record, do you trust the logic of taking a $1,000 pine tree, cutting it up, turning it to pulp, putting some ink on it, and then calling it one billion $ dollars?
  6. [verwijderd] 9 oktober 2011 14:50
    Dutch Secretary of the Treasury answers questions about whereabouts of the Central Banks gold

    (Het Nederlands artikel volgt snel)
    September 18 we published these questions and here are the first answers.
    We repeat the questions of the Dutch Socialistic Party with the answers of the Secretary, and follow up with first comments of the Vrijspreker. We think further questions are justified!

    Question —Answer—Comment
    1
    Did the Dutch Central Bank (DNB) loan part of their gold?
    If yes, how much and to whom?
    No. DNB has informed me that they have stopped loaning out gold as of 2008.
    Comments Vrijspreker: if so, why doesn’t DNB make that clear in the annual report? Why hide such crucial information.
    2
    Why are gold and gold loans stated as one line item in the annual report 2010 instead of mentioned as 2 separate items?
    DNB follows the rules for valuation, determination of result and balance sheet presentation of the European system of Central Banks. The asset ‘Gold and Gold Receivables’ reflects the physical gold inventory.
    Comments Vrijspreker: good international accounting standards oblige companies to separate cash from receivables, as they’re clearly different. Why wouldn’t these standards apply to central banks? In times of increasing civil unrest because of opaque financial schemes being set up by governments, central and commercial banks and the demand for more transparency, how would you justify these special rules for central banks? Are they above the law?
    3
    Can you give an overview of the yearly yields of the gold loans during the past years?
    No gold has been loaned out over the past years.
    4
    Where IS the physical gold of DNB? At which locations and how much is where?
    What is the reason that the gold is still at these locations?
    DNB has a location policy, which means that the gold has been spread over the following locations: New York, Ottawa, London and Amsterdam.
    Comments Vrijspreker: why doesn’t the Secretary answer all the questions? What is the amount per location? And what exactly is the location policy? Why New York instead of any random other city? Also it’s important to know how often and by whom the vaults are audited.
    5
    What was the most important reason for DNB to sell the gold in the past? Are the storage costs a reason? What are the actual costs to store the gold?
    By selling gold in the past, DNB has tried to align its gold holdings with other gold holding countries. The storage costs were not a factor in the decision to sell the gold, because they are relatively low. Currently, DNB’s total annual storage costs paid to other central banks amount to a few hundreds of thousands of euros. The costs vary per location.
    Comments Vrijspreker: why would DNB want to align its gold holdings with other central banks’ holdings? Is there a coordinated central policy amongst all central banks? Has this been prescribed by the Bank of International Settlements? Are the recent gold purchases by developing countries’ central banks not conflicting with this international policy. Could you outline the details of this policy?
    6
    Can you confirm that since 1991 of the 1700 tons of gold about 1100 tons have been sold?
    Is the remark of journalist Peter de Waard correct that because of these historic sales there is a loss of about 30 billion euro?
    If not correct, what is the right amount?
    Since 1991, 1,100 tons of gold have been sold. Back then it was concluded that DNB held relatively much gold compared to other central banks. Decided was to align the amount of gold with other important gold owning countries. Sales proceeds have been added to DNB’s general reserves and have been invested in interest generating investments. Comparing the actual, as a result of the financial crisis, higher gold price with the historical gold price does indeed lead to more or less the amount as mentioned by Mr. De Waard. However, one has to take into account the investment income generated since selling the gold and the fact that the result of said calculations heavily depend of the strongly fluctuating price of gold.
    Comments Vrijspreker: again, why align the gold holdings with that of other central banks? What exactly is the purpose of that policy?
    7
    How much of the National Debt has during the past 20 years been paid off with the proceeds of the gold sales? Are you of opinion that the sustainability of the national debt will be improved by paying off the debt and at the same time selling the gold?
    Gold is an asset of DNB. The sales proceeds have been invested in other assets and have hence not been used to reduce the national debt. The return on investments will flow back to the Dutch government as a result of DNB’s dividend payments.
    8
    What is in your opinion the present function of the gold stock?
    DNB’s physical gold holdings function as the ultimate reserve and anchor of trust in times of financial crisis. Further, gold is being held for diversification reasons.
    Comments Vrijspreker: clearly DNB sees value in gold. For that reason, it needs to be more transparent, and so should all central banks.
    9
    What is the relation between the size of the market of the gold stock and the size of the market of gold derivates? What are the possible consequences of this?
    The size of the physical gold market and derivatives market cannot easily be compared because of diverging measures for the size. For the trade in physical gold the turnover is measured: in the most important market (London) this amounted to USD 136 billion in the second half of 2010 according to the London Bullion Market Association. For the derivatives market the underlying value of outstanding derivatives (swaps, future contracts and options) is of importance. For the second half of 2010 these amounted to USD 396 billion according to the Bank of International Settlements. In general one can say that the availability of derivatives markets promote efficient price discovery.
    10
    Can you confirm that recently a number of countries have even enlarged their physical gold stock? Do you have an explanation for this development?
    Buyers are developing economies that show strongly growing official reserves or where gold traditionally only constituted a small portion of the reserves. There is also a wide group of countries that have sold gold the past decade (including France, Spain, UK and Switzerland)

    If you don't trust GOLD,the only asset with a 6000 year track record, do you trust the logic of taking a $1,000 pine tree, cutting it up, turning it to pulp, putting some ink on it, and then calling it one billion $ dollars?
  7. [verwijderd] 10 oktober 2011 16:17
    quote:

    haas schreef op 9 oktober 2011 15:09:

    @ Gung Ho,

    welke conclusies trekt u uit de antwoorden op de gestelde vragen ?
    Ha die haas,

    Tjah wat kun je verwachten van loopjongens zoals die bolle taxichauffeur en die lintwurm die zoveel "succes" heeft gehad met zijn maatregel om honderduizenden mensen voor de statistieken in plaats van in de bijstand de Wajong in te jagen. Rechts mag van deze schaamteloze kameraden nu vooral zijn eigen vingers afbijten... over windbuilen en windhandel gesproken

    Zoals te verwachten multiinterpretabele nietszeggende opmerkingen over wat toch echt het tafelzilver & goud van iedere Nl er behoord te zijn.

    Je zou toch zeggen, dat een beetje meer respectvolle verantwoording afleggen voor het met bloed zweet en tranen eeuwenoud opgebouwd harde bezit wat meer op zijn plaats zou zijn. Echter niets van dit alles, overigens nog een mooie gotspe dat de enige partij die officieel het maoisme heeft afgezworen juist nu deze vragen moet stellen.

    De rest van deze marxistische (regerings)partijen is vooral hard bezig hun maoistische vrindjes tevreden te stellen.

    Outsourcen, cross border constructies het zal ze allemaal wat....

    Er is overigens een hele simpele oplossing, gewoon een audit en al het goud wat niet in NL ligt als de donderse bliksem naar NL terughalen.

    Maar dat gaat uiteraard niet gebeuren, was in de tachtig en de negentiger jaren aandeelhouder van de BIS de Bank de Banken oftewel de bank van alle centrale banken, wat de medeaandeelhouders zoals de FED, DNB, etc met de retailaandeelhouders zoals ondergetekende hebben uitgespookt spreekt boekdelen, het belooft hoe dan ook weinig goeds, het zijn namelijk altijd de niet democratisch gekozen NGO's en poliburos zoals FED, ECB, ESF, DNB , BUNDESBANK etc die feitelijk de dienst uitmaken los van welke politieke loopjongens het volk trachten te bestoken met allerhande loze beloftes. Nivelleren is nog steeds de NWO boodschap, globalisering is nivellering...

    Het is niet anders ik kan er niets moois meer van bakken, de vrije markt en het kapitalisme zijn al jaren zo goed als vernietigd.

    Hier overigens de de antwoorden in Nl

    www.vrijspreker.nl/wp/2011/10/98630/

    Succes en we zullen zien

    GH

    If you don't trust GOLD,the only asset with a 6000 year track record, do you trust the logic of taking a $1,000 pine tree, cutting it up, turning it to pulp, putting some ink on it, and then calling it one billion $ dollars?
  8. [verwijderd] 11 oktober 2011 15:19
    m.b.t. dit stukje:

    "Je zou toch zeggen, dat een beetje meer respectvolle verantwoording afleggen voor het met bloed zweet en tranen eeuwenoud opgebouwd harde bezit wat meer op zijn plaats zou zijn."

    dat goud weggeven was waarschijnlijk zo makkelijk omdat dat bloed, zweet en tranen vnl van 'onze'(VOC etc.) slachtoffers waren...

    We danken hier in NL veel rijkdom aan de tijd dat zeerovers nog gewoon een nationale vlag voerden en slavenhandelaren aanzien en respect genoten. Aan sluwe ideeen en praktijken ontbrak het de mensen in de lage landen i.i.g. niet.

    Het zij zo en daar plukken wij hedentendage nog steeds de vruchten van...maar of je dat als nationale trots wilt kwalificeren is een ander verhaal.
  9. forum rang 7 ffff 11 oktober 2011 18:07


    Een beetje cynisch....Maar voor de goudkevers is onderstaand bericht erg positief: Plots heet een Europese Centrale Bank een ongewoon grote hoeveelhied goud verkocht voor bijna 200 miljoen Euro. De afgelopen 15 Jaar hebben alle Europese Centrale banken nogal wat goud verkocht en bleken ze nu niet direct de beste handelaren te zijn. Laten we het maar ronduit zeggen: Erg beroerde timing voor hun goudverkopen. Nu dus weer opnieuw. Tja, het zou natuurlijk kunnen dat ze nu eindelijk een betere timing hebben, maar als we de geschiedenis van de afgelopen 15 jaar doortrekken.....Zitten ze d'r weer naast.

    Ungewöhnlich hoher Goldverkauf durch eine Notenbank der Eurozone

    FRANKFURT (dpa-AFX) - Eine Zentralbank der Eurozone hat in der vergangenen Woche eine ungewöhnlich große Menge an Gold verkauft. Wie die Europäische Zentralbank (EZB) am Dienstag mitteilte, habe eine einzelne Zentralbank der Eurozone Gold im Wert von 181 Millionen Euro auf den Markt geworfen. Wie üblich teilte die EZB nicht mit, um welche Notenbank es sich handelt. In der Regel kaufen oder verkaufen Notenbanken Goldbestände im niedrigen einstelligen Millionenbereich.




    Ein Goldverkauf einer einzelnen Notenbank in dieser Menge sei "ungewöhnlich", kommentierte der Rohstoffexperte Eugen Weinberg von der Commerzbank das Geschäft. Beim aktuellen Goldpreis könne bei dem Verkauf von einer Menge von etwa vier Tonnen ausgegangen werden. Ein Verkauf in dieser Größenordnung sei vor allem deshalb bemerkenswert, weil Notenbanken zuletzt eher als Goldkäufer am Markt aufgetreten seien.



    Die Goldbestände sind ein wichtiger Bestandteil der Reserven von Notenbanken in der Eurozone. Deutschland verfügt derzeit nach Angaben des Branchenverbandes World Gold Council über eine Goldreserve in einem Volumen von etwa 3.400 Tonnen. Das hoch verschuldete Griechenland verfügt immerhin über eine Reserve von etwa 111 Tonnen. Der Goldpreis ist am Dienstag um 8,94 Dollar je Feinunze (etwa 31 Gramm) auf 1.665,59 Dollar gesunken./jkr/bgf
  10. [verwijderd] 11 oktober 2011 18:11
    quote:

    ffff schreef op 11 oktober 2011 18:07:

    Een beetje cynisch....Maar voor de goudkevers is onderstaand bericht erg positief: Plots heet een Europese Centrale Bank een ongewoon grote hoeveelhied goud verkocht voor bijna 200 miljoen Euro. De afgelopen 15 Jaar hebben alle Europese Centrale banken nogal wat goud verkocht en bleken ze nu niet direct de beste handelaren te zijn. Laten we het maar ronduit zeggen: Erg beroerde timing voor hun goudverkopen. Nu dus weer opnieuw. Tja, het zou natuurlijk kunnen dat ze nu eindelijk een betere timing hebben, maar als we de geschiedenis van de afgelopen 15 jaar doortrekken.....Zitten ze d'r weer naast.

    Mogelijk weten zij meer en zien een hoogtepunt en verkopen daarom.

    Heb je veel goud Peter? doe dan mee en pak wat winst voordat het weer verdampt.

  11. forum rang 6 haas 11 oktober 2011 18:41
    als er 'bank voor 200 miljoen goud verkoopt kan ik daaruit geen conlusies trekken.?
    Ik ken niet de motieven,achtergronden waarom dat is gebeurd.........?

    Én al helemaal kan ik daar geen conclusies aan verbinden m.b.t. de goudprijs ontwikkeling. Ik kan er van alles bij bedenken,maar dat is ,imo, suggestief/speculatief ?

    PS: ook vandaag zijn er investeerders die goud hebben gekocht. Anderen hebben dus verkocht ?
  12. forum rang 6 haas 11 oktober 2011 18:44
    quote:

    haas schreef op 9 oktober 2011 15:09:

    @ Gung Ho,

    welke conclusies trekt u uit de antwoorden op de gestelde vragen ?
    uw reactie op mijn vraag geeft antwoord op welke kwalificaties u toekent aan de vragenstellers ?
    Mijn vraag richt zich op de gegeven antwoorden door Min. van Financien
  13. [verwijderd] 11 oktober 2011 22:33
    Hi Haas,

    Wellicht viel uit mijn "cynische" reactie niet helemaal qua duidelijkheid mbt deze gegeven antwoorden te halen.

    Maar ik geloof stellig en al heel heel lang dat het merendeel van het genoemde fysieke Nederlandse Goud niet meer FYSIEK aanwezig is of nog onder feitelijke controle staat van de DNB of welke entiteit van het Nederlandse Volk dan ook die dit GOUD fysiek zou kunnen of eerder DURVEN opeisen.

    MBT de " kwaliteit" van deze reactie vande Cab driver nog het volgende, het zijn wat mij betreft dan ook totaal bewust en doordacht niets zeggende antwoorden, die ik zelf als ik advocaat van deze duivels ook gebruikt zou kunnen hebben, echter de PROOF is in the GOLD pudding, neem bv de hele Tweede Kamer + media circus eens mee en laat eens en voor altijd zien wie over dit harde NL Bezit hier dan wel de BAAS over is, en als het GOUD er ligt en neem het subiet mee terug naar NEDERLAND!!!!

    Volgens heel wat bronnen bezitten met name de westerse CB's nog maar over heel weinig FYSIEK GOUD, en in termen zoals "deep storage" en papieren derivaten, swaps etc hecht ik ( niet alleen) geen enkele waarde.

    quote:

    haas schreef op 11 oktober 2011 18:44:

    [...]

    uw reactie op mijn vraag geeft antwoord op welke kwalificaties u toekent aan de vragenstellers ?
    Mijn vraag richt zich op de gegeven antwoorden door Min. van Financien
    Succes en we zullen zien

    GH

    If you don't trust GOLD,the only asset with a 6000 year track record, do you trust the logic of taking a $1,000 pine tree, cutting it up, turning it to pulp, putting some ink on it, and then calling it one billion $ dollars?
  14. [verwijderd] 19 oktober 2011 09:38
    PRECIOUS-Gold steady after Moody's downgrades Spain
    Wed Oct 19, 2011 12:45am GMT Print | Single Page [-] Text [+]
    SINGAPORE, Oct 19 (Reuters) - Gold prices held steady on
    Wednesday, after Moody's cut Spain's credit ratings, adding to
    uncertainties over whether European leaders would come up with a
    solution to the bloc's debt crisis at a meeting this weekend.

    FUNDAMENTALS
    * Spot gold was little changed at $1,657.89 an ounce
    by 0031 GMT, after falling 0.9 percent in the previous session.
    * U.S. gold GCcv1 edged up 0.4 percent to $1,659.60.
    * Doubt cast on France's triple-A credit rating by Moody's
    raised uncertainty over Europe's hopes of drawing a line under
    its sovereign debt crisis, five days before a crucial EU summit.

    * Moody's also cut Spain's sovereign ratings by two notches,
    saying high levels of debt in the banking system and corporate
    sector leave the country vulnerable to funding stress.

    * Britain's Guardian newspaper reported on Tuesday that
    France and Germany had agreed to boost a euro zone financial
    rescue fund to two trillion euros ($2.76 trillion).

    * Goldman Sachs Group Inc's commodities business
    generated more revenue in the third quarter but treacherous
    markets forced it to slash risks, contributing to the overall
    loss at Wall Street's top bank.
    * Asia's physical gold demand is likely to pick up as prices
    drop near $1,650, dealers have said.
    * Holdings of the world's largest gold-backed
    exchange-traded fund, SPDR Gold Trust , were unchanged for
    past four sessions at 1,227.511 tonnes. Holdings of iShares
    Silver Trust remained at 9,954.27 tonnes, unchanged since
    Oct. 10.

    If you don't trust GOLD,the only asset with a 6000 year track record, do you trust the logic of taking a $1,000 pine tree, cutting it up, turning it to pulp, putting some ink on it, and then calling it one billion $ dollars?
  15. Zilverduit 19 oktober 2011 09:48
    @ invoorentegenspoed de Nederlandse welvaart is toch met name afkomstig van de handel op de Oostzee. De WIC was een drama en heeft veel geld gekost uiteindelijk de VOC idem. Er zullen altijd individuen veel geld hebben verdient, maar de handel op de Oostzee was het belangrijkste voor onze huidige welvaart.
  16. [verwijderd] 21 oktober 2011 23:51
    Lees de oorspronkelijke draad: uitstekende samenvatiing van het wel en wee van de goudmarkt de afgelopen decennia

    Chris Powell: Where in the world is the gold?

    Submitted by cpowell on Fri, 2011-10-21 19:39. Section: Daily Dispatches
    Remarks by Chris Powell?Secretary/Treasurer, Gold Anti-Trust Action Committee Inc.?Fall Dinner Meeting?Committee for Monetary Research and Education?Union League Club?New York, N.Y.?Thursday, October 20, 2011

    www.gata.org/node/10587
    CMRE President Elizabeth Currier chose the title of my remarks -- "Where in the World Is the Gold?" -- and I didn't argue with her, but if I knew where the gold was, they'd have to kill me. And if I knew and told you before they got to me, you'd all have a big problem too.
    But for our purposes tonight it is enough to know that we will never be permitted to know, at least not in the current political circumstances.
    Having been raising questions about the gold market for 12 years now, I've realized that the amounts, location, and disposition of government gold reserves are secrets more sensitive than the amounts, location, and disposition of nuclear weapons. Indeed, under nuclear weapons control treaties, governments with nuclear weapons have often shared that sort of information, even with hostile powers. But gold reserve information is far more tightly held and most gold information provided officially is actually disinformation.
    Why is it this way?
    It's because gold is an even more powerful weapon than nukes -- an alternative currency that is not necessarily under any governments power, a determinant of the value of other currencies, interest rates, government bonds, and equities.
    It's not just me saying this. Lawrence Summers, former U.S. Treasury Secretary and off-and-on economics professor at Harvard, said so in the study he wrote with University of Michigan economics professor Robert Barsky in the Journal of Political Economy in 1988, a study titled "Gibson's Paradox and the Gold Standard." This study is posted at the Internet site of my organization:
    www.gata.org/files/gibson.pdf
    A few weeks ago, maintaining that his "Gibson's Paradox" study remains dispositive of the gold price issue, Summers provided it to New York Times columnist Paul Krugman -- and did so by giving Krugman the link to it at GATA's Internet site. That's what Krugman wrote on his blog.

    This close correlation among gold, interest rates, and government bond values is why central banks long have tried to control -- usually suppress -- the price of gold. For gold is the ticket out of the central banking system, the escape from coercive central bank and government power. As an independent currency, a currency to which investors can resort when they are dissatisfied with government currencies, gold carries the enormous power to discipline governments, to call them to account for their inflation of the money supply and to warn the world against it. Because gold is the vehicle of escape from the central banking system, the manipulation of the gold market is the manipulation that makes possible all other market manipulation by government.

    That manipulation operates through the largely surreptitious mobilization of Western central bank gold reserves and the gold nominally held by the major exchange-traded funds. If the manipulation was done completely in the open, as governments used to manipulate the gold market, through the gold standard and then through what was called the London Gold Pool, the Western central bank gold dishoarding scheme of the 1960s, the manipulation would fail, because then the world would understand that there isn't a free market in gold -- or in any currency, any more than there is a free market in government bonds.
    Anyone can determine this for himself just by putting the unanswerable questions to central bankers and treasury officials.
    For example, three years ago, as the International Monetary Fund was constantly announcing plans to sell some of its gold, I wrote to the IMF to try to determine exactly where its supposed gold was kept and whether the IMF had control of its own gold or if that gold was only pledges of gold from its member nations. The most I got out of the IMF was that its bylaws allow its gold to be stored in the United States, Britain, France, and India. When I asked if there ever had been an audit of the IMF's gold, the IMF's publicist terminated our correspondence. I was refused information as to where the IMF's gold was.
    At the hearing held on March 25, 2010, by the U.S. Commodity Futures Trading Commission to inquire into the precious metals market, the managing director of the metals consultancy CPM Group in New York, Jeff Christian, a consultant to central banks, testified to what he had published in an explanatory essay in 2000. Christian testified that the world's biggest gold market, the London bullion market, is actually part of a fractional-reserve gold banking system where many times more gold is sold than is delivered. Most London gold buyers don't take delivery, and so most gold in client accounts on the books of the London bullion banks doesn't exist. It is just an unsecured claim against the bullion banks, which presumably have assurances that, in an emergency like a short squeeze, they can obtain gold from central banks.
    That is, Western central banks have figured out how to increase gold's supply by vast amounts without going through the trouble of digging it out of the ground. They help to invent and sustain "paper gold" -- imaginary gold that many buyers accept, never suspecting that they're being deceived and cheated, fooled into thinking that they are buying a finite resource to hedge against the infinite creation of currency, when what they are buying is just as subject to infinite creation as the currency they want to hedge against.

    If you don't trust GOLD,the only asset with a 6000 year track record, do you trust the logic of taking a $1,000 pine tree, cutting it up, turning it to pulp, putting some ink on it, and then calling it one billion $ dollars?
  17. [verwijderd] 22 november 2011 13:53
    Uiteraard ben ik ook behoorlijk vast op zilver, zoals een aantal ouwe getrouwen zich nog wel herinneren heb een behoorlijke partij fysiek destijds rondom de bodem van dit decennium zelfs vaak 15 % onder spot kunnen kopen.

    Bepaaldelijk geen slecht rendement op papier tot nu toe... maar goed hier een leuk berichtje voor silverbugs.
    Let vooral op wat Embry in de laatste regeltjes voorspelt..........

    Every once in a while, the folks at Canaccord’s Morning Coffee put out something interesting. Their comments on Silver we figure are definitely worth getting out there.
    They write, “This decade will be the decade of silver.” Re- cently, Sprott Asset Management’s Eric Sprott was inter- viewed by Seeking Alpha regarding his thoughts on silver. Sprott stated, "My thesis being that even though the last decade has been the decade of gold, this decade will be the decade of silver. I can only imagine that it will go back to its historical relationship to gold of 16- to-one in term of price. And as an example of 16-to-one, with gold at $1,600 it would suggest that the silver price should be $100. And most of the data that I look at certainly as it pertains to day to day markets, and I don’t mean the Comex, we're not talk- ing about that, we're talking about the physical market for silver, and we have data points that suggest that buying for silver by the public is almost on a ratio of dollars of silver being bought to dollars of gold being bought. We can see that the U.S. Mint’s data that comes out every month, and pretty much every day, so for example, the amount of silver coins being bought through the mint’s service – they sold 50 times the number of silver to gold coins.
    This month it’s actually running around 70–to-one. This really means people are putting as many dollars into silver as they are into gold. But there is nowhere near the amount of silver to invest in as there is gold." Sprott highlighted that, a year ago, his firm put in an order for 15 million ounces of silver, which was worth about $300 million, which Sprott said noted is not a lot of silver. "It took us three months for us to get the silver and some of that silver that was delivered to us was manufactured after we had made the purchase agreement.
    Which really means, in my mind, there wasn’t a tremen- dous amount of silver lying around waiting to be delivered," Sprott said. "I just don’t believe there’s huge amounts of silver and we are buyers of silver every day. We’re very often delayed on our shipments. You know we could go in and buy 2 or 300 thousand ounces and we sort of get the common, 'Well, you know that shipment is going to take two or three weeks,' which really means, I don’t think there is really any ready silver inventory that’s just waiting for someone to say, 'Ok, fine.
    I’m going to buy.' Then, 'We’ll deliver it to you' because it’s not really that difficult to deliver silver." Also of note, during a November 8 interview with King World News, Sprott Asset Management's Chief investment Strategist, John Embry, stated, "I mean it’s hard to get silver and you have to pay premiums for it. The real price of silver is in the physical market. This paper market is a complete and utter sham and when the paper market is broken, and I think we’re close to that happening, silver will double overnight into the $60-70 area and that could happen within months.”

    If you don't trust GOLD,the only asset with a 6000 year track record, do you trust the logic of taking a $1,000 pine tree, cutting it up, turning it to pulp, putting some ink on it, and then calling it one billion $ dollars?
  18. [verwijderd] 30 november 2011 16:47
    Is gold just a safe haven or will it re-enter the monetary system?
    With the eurozone poised on a knife edge, it seems gold investors are having to try and decide on which side it is likely to fall.
    Author: Geoff Candy
    Posted: Wednesday , 30 Nov 2011


    GRONINGEN -
    Gold investors seem to be splitting into two camps at the moment, those that believe there is absolutely no future for the Euro and those that, while concerned remain hopeful that the world as we know it isn't about to come crashing to an end.
    UBS it seems falls into the latter category. In its Global Commodities Outlook report for 2012, the bank writes: "We expect the Eurozone crisis to intensify to the point of a ‘big bang', namely only when the clear alternatives are breaking up the Eurozone or systemic collapse will EU politicians be compelled to accelerate fiscal convergence; that should ultimately change sentiment significantly."
    That point seems to be rapidly approaching and, is most likely going to be reached one way or the other during the next ten days, the whirlwind timetable for which is well spelt out by today's edition of the Financial Times.
    And, the bank does acknowledge that 2012 is likely to be overshadowed by "the potential of a coercive Greek default forcing an exit from the Eurozone, major bank failures, and the long-term yields of Italian and Spanish bonds remaining above 7% for an extended time. All these events could puncture sentiment, trigger credit squeeze and would almost certainly result in lower commodity prices."
    But, it says, such events could be counterbalanced by "preemptive policy action by the US, China and EU to recapitalise EU banks and restructure peripheral European debt. Concerted global action may have a significant stimulus effect on the more leveraged and commodity intensive economies such as the emerging markets."
    For some, like independent Investment consultant and 40-yearveteran of the markets, Rick Schmull, such hope is unfounded as the point of no return has been reached.
    Speaking on Mineweb.com's Gold Weekly podcast, Schmull said, "Things will get much worse and there is no soft option ahead....I see a sudden break up - it will be overnight. I think the problems are too large - the whole thing is coming crashing down suddenly and we will have a number of years of depression in Europe."
    So what does this mean for gold?
    Looking at the worst-case scenario first, for Schmull, the destruction of the euro will mean an increasing role for gold.
    "Obviously gold will play an increasingly large role in the solution to our problems because the FIAT money system that we've had in the last 40 years is on its last legs because unlimited credit is impossible and eventually implodes - and that's what we've had. We've had a system with no discipline and eventually gold will have to re-enter the monetary system at a much higher price which also means of course, a dramatic devaluation of all currencies within the current system," he said.
    For UBS, the future, while by no means rosy, isn't quite as apocalyptic.
    "We continue to see gold more as a ‘safe haven' rather than a ‘risk-on' asset in 2012, as the European sovereign debt crisis, exacerbated by recession, and the US debt concerns, returning in Q112E when its US$15.2trn debt ceiling is likely, reached, are expected to dominate investor sentiment again, it writes, adding, "We view the risk of European CB gold sales as extremely limited. A modestly stronger US dollar for 2012E could cap gold's advance. Strong physical buying needs to persist, as otherwise gold is heavily dependent on investor participation."
    Given the volatility and the political brinkmanship happening both intentionally and unintentionally around the world at the moment, there is no real way to tell which side of the edge Europe will fall; although it is clichéd, about the only thing one can say with certainty at the moment is that more uncertainty looms. And that gold will have a role to play.

    If you don't trust GOLD,the only asset with a 6000 year track record, do you trust the logic of taking a $1,000 pine tree, cutting it up, turning it to pulp, putting some ink on it, and then calling it one billion $ dollars?
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